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Comment List
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I'm sure that the Lord helped you with that answer.
I'm glad that it helped her as I agree that being gay is a sin.
God bless you as you deal with the youth. This must be a difficult job.
Pat
2006-11-15 00:04:56 Posted by Pat ()
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Consequences of sin that the non believer can even understand:
http://jersey.uoregon.edu/~mstrick/RogueComCollege/RCC_Lectures/LoveCanal.html
Jon,
I have heard this one before. I think you are on the correct tack. Indeed, I see the concept of original sin in light much the way you have described, although I am even willing to understand that God may have at the moment of man’s fall, allowed/caused (this is my reference to Love Canal and Dioxin) imperfections to be injected into our genetic code to reflect our fallen nature, so that we were not as much like God as we were before. I have even heard it suggested that before the fall, our bodies were more like that of an immortal being, although I see no scriptural basis for that, and such conjecture I classify along with arguments of how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. It may be that people are predisposed to all sorts over evils, great and small. Kleptomania, Pedophilia, Arson. And there are disabilities that are more accepted as genetically rooted. ADHD, ADD, Downs Syndrome, Sickle Cell Anemia, Hemophilia, Autism. The thing is, we deal with them. We adjust for the disabilities. We attempt to control those aberrant behaviors. Unfortunately, although Homosexuality is not considered truly aberrant in the ‘Politically Correct’ circles, (a prime example of why I consider PC to be a derogatory term more properly translated as Probably Crap) we have very definite guidance in God’s Word that it is. Which do we choose to believe in this context? God, or all knowing human society? (I am being sarcastic in asking that rhetorical question, of course, but the sad part is that my sarcasm is lost on most of the world, and indeed some professing christians on this matter.)
I have heard of research on cadavers of known homosexuals being compared to those of normal men and women. Supposedly, homosexual men have some brain topography that resembles that of women more than normal men. This is used as an argument for being ‘born’ queer. It may be true. Does that mean that such an aberration should not be resisted? But even that argument is flawed in this: Which is cause and which is effect? In other words, did the different brain topography cause them to behave in queer ways, or did their predilection for this particular perversion cause the deviation in the normal topography?
Talk firmly with all of your young people on this. Please, Jon! The world is full of the evil idea that this is right. In public schools in Washington State, for example, a questionnaire designed to deal with acceptance of different lifestyles and living in harmony asked a very leading question: “How do you know you would not like homosexual relations if you have not tried them?” This is a paraphrase, but you just as well might ask “How do you know you would not like Arson unless you torched a couple of buildings and watched them burn?” The presupposition in both questions is the same. The behavior in question is inferred to not be wrong in and of itself, and that only the hedonistic pleasure matters. Most High School Students are perceptive, but this is so subtle that it is easily missed.
Speak Strongly and Boldly, Jon. I implore you to be like you describe the Apostle John.
Go in God’s Wisdom Alone,
Mel
2006-11-15 12:23:32 Posted by Mel ()
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Romans 12:2
"And do not be conformed to this world,
but be transformed by the renewing of your
mind, that you may prove what is that good
and acceptable and perfect will of God." Hugsml
2006-11-15 16:22:19 Posted by Mary Lou ()
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Hi Jon,
As Mel stated, speak Strongly and Boldly. Be like, you described the Apostle John......
God made Adam and Eve, (not Adam and Steve)
God bless!
With God's Love.....
2006-11-16 01:51:06 Posted by Lois ()
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as one who spent 20 years in that life before being a christian i can tell you all that you have musch to learn
2006-11-16 05:14:45 Posted by anonymous ()
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You seem to contradict yourself, Mr. Johnson. You say you don’t believe anyone is born gay. And you say being gay is one aspect of our innate sinful nature. I disagree in the latter. I have sinned, and I have quite thoroughly sinned. But I have not ever felt any homosexual lust. I have always found the thought of two men sleeping with another disgusting, also before The Lord let me grasp Christ. Also I have never been tempted to murder. And I have never felt for robbing banks. The notion of original sin in this respect is wrong since we are indeed born with faith and since we after Christ indeed are made to be responsible persons. There are, though, two seeds in the world (Genesis 3:15).
When committing a sin, if being the seed of the Son of Man, one is not true to oneself. One’s faith is not strong enough to resist the actual temptation. And so the girl wondering upon if she might be gay is in lack of faith – in the Son, being God’s purpose with her and redeeming her, and being what man as such is supposed to be like. She lacks faith in Man as such. A homosexual act is a sin: Speaking of the woman her mission, being the Son of Man, is her own. And speaking of the man – well, the man is supposed to be a man. Becoming a homosexual, though, is like giving up faith altogether. The Son is ridiculed, is scorn, by homosexuality. So the advice to the girl should in my mind be: Read Paulus on the subject.
Yours,
A.W. Ellingsen (My ChristiansUniteBlog)
2006-11-16 06:59:37 Posted by awellingsen (awell@online.no)
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I admit freely that I could learn volumes on the subject. But I know sin, as we all do.
I'm afraid "Read Paulus" might not have been a helpful response to a troubled teenager.
"Born gay", at least to my experience, is used as a shortcut to saying "I was meant to be like this". When I said that I didn't think anyone was born gay, I meant no one has that excuse. I said "There is a lot of complcated psychology here" which I meant to say that I have a lot to learn about the subject.
I then said, "or rather, that we are born sinners in every way". Not contradicting but RATHER explaining the previous statement.
A W you may not have been tempted to murder but as Jesus explained if you have been angry, you have been tempted to murder. Thay are the same root feelings. I am afraid that the Word is quite clear. The heart is desperately wicked. Read Paul.
2006-11-16 09:40:38 Posted by Jon ()
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A.W. you may lack the most in understanding. Just because you were not tempted in certain ways doesn't make those who were any less or more sinful. We all were condemnded to the same fate without Christ. It is NOT a lack of faith, it is deceit from the devil! At a very young age the devil begins convincing those who would be easily convinced because of certain circumstances in their lives that they must be gay. Approx. 85% of all gay people say they experienced a kind of seperation from their same-sex parent. Also, if a young child has admiration for someone of the same sex, the devil tries to convince them they must be gay. There are many factors to this terrible deception. But the most important thing to know is that it IS deception. Looking back it is easy to point out the places where i was open to be deceived. Tell your young friend about this deception and help her to see it for what it is. A BIG LIE!
2006-11-17 05:13:49 Posted by anonoymous ()
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Hello 'anonoymous'. May The Lord give you faith to be a person.
2006-11-17 06:06:54 Posted by A.W. Ellingsen (awell@online.no)
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Again, Mr. Johnson, I disagree with the second part of your argument – with the “on the other side” part. What you write there is wrong: Man was never meant to sin – was never meant to feel for sinning.
Jesus said: “Go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy [compassion], not sacrifice. For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” Sacrificing unto The Lord one sees oneself as one for The Lord to respect, to ask, to be grateful to. One justifies oneself unto The Lord having made one a sinful character. Then one cannot show mercy, cannot be in the name of The Lord. Sinners will show mercy, themselves dependent upon The Lord. And they will feel free to act in the name of The Lord, will be able to be holy unto The Lord, when they feel The Lord has taken their sins upon Him. Sinners know what mercy is: Sinners know they were never meant to sin. Still The Lord has freed them. But one cannot show mercy if one feel like sacrificing when showing “mercy” – when not acting in the name of God. One cannot be good if one is the wrong seed of man. The evil one will feel righteous unto The Lord - sacrificing. The homosexual will feel like being in his right when he possesses another man, sacrificing if he does not follow his desire. So I hope you will agree with me an urge to sleep with another man is to stand in danger for loosing faith altogether – for to fall in the wrong category of man. It is like thinking: “I am damned anyhow. Why not empower myself.” Homosexuality is not to excuse. Psychology which does so is the work of Satan.
2006-11-17 06:07:37 Posted by A.W. Ellingsen (awell@online.no)
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Annonoymous, I would love to hear more from you on this. Anything that you think I should know or would help.
I have very little practical knowledge in this area, but it seems to me that if you have come through this you have tremendous faith, and strength.
2006-11-17 09:46:49 Posted by Jon ()
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A.W. May the Lord deliver you from self-righteousness.
2006-11-17 15:37:41 Posted by anonymous ()
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Matthew 5:18-20 (AMP)
18For truly I tell you, until the sky and earth pass away and perish, not one smallest letter nor one little hook [identifying certain Hebrew letters] will pass from the Law until all things [it foreshadows] are accomplished.
19Whoever then breaks or does away with or relaxes one of the least [important] of these commandments and teaches men so shall be called least [important] in the kingdom of heaven, but he who practices them and teaches others to do so shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
20For I tell you, unless your righteousness (your uprightness and your right standing with God) is more than that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 23:23-24 (AMP)
23Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, pretenders (hypocrites)! For you give a tenth of your mint and dill and cummin, and have neglected and omitted the weightier (more important) matters of the Law--right and justice and mercy and fidelity. These you ought [particularly] to have done, without neglecting the others.
24You blind guides, filtering out a gnat and gulping down a camel!
2006-11-17 18:01:15 Posted by Anonymous ()
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Amen to that. I so agree. We all are capable of ANY SIN. It is only by the Grace of God I am not struggling with being gay, it could be any of us.
2006-11-24 19:18:46 Posted by By Grace ()
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2007-01-12 19:10:47 Posted by Anonymous ()
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2007-01-16 11:46:58 Posted by Anonymous ()
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